welcome everybody to the disruptors the future of work is now I am Alexandria I am one of the co-founders of the disruptors and I have my co-founder Jasleen with me and quick introduction about me I am a leadership coach I have been in leadership for over 15 years I come out of the therapy world originally fell face first into Tech and then used coaching to bridge that World We Now run the disruptors which is a job board that supports people from underrepresented communities to get jobs they can thrive in with companies that are prioritizing diversity equity and inclusion I’m going to turn it over to Jasleen so she can introduce herself yeah so I’m Jasleen I’m a career coach for mostly women who identify as high potential in the tech space my background my educational background is actually in Psychology so I could I could really be selfish and pick Dr carrion’s Brain on organizational psych stuff because my undergrad was in IO psych and yeah and so then I worked in corporate HR for 10 years and I’m excited to be here to talk about this today heart centered approach to your organization and just as people are joining maybe just let us know in the chat that you’re here and let us know where you’re joining from and how cold it is where you are because I just want to say if you think it’s cold where you are it cannot be as cold as where I am right now in Canada it’s going to be minus it’s minus 30 Celsius today it’s gonna be minus 36 Celsius tomorrow which is about minus 32 Fahrenheit so let us know how cold is it where you are and where are you joining from and so I’ll pass it on over to Dr carrianne to tell us a little bit about yourself and what brought you to this Dei a space thank you jessaline thank you Alexandra it is so nice to be with you guys again um I will start off by letting you know I’m in South Florida so much warmer than we are then where you are it’s in the 70s here

um so it’s warmer here but um yeah my name is Dr Carrie Anne Parrott and uh my pronouns are she her they couldn’t all fit on the screen in my in my tag but those are my pronouns and I got into this Dei space I tell people I think I’ve pretty much just been in it my whole life as it pertains to living in the United States it has been a deia adventure but a fast

that’s pretty much how I’ve had to navigate uh cross-cultural aspects of my identity and particularly in the workspace um work ethics Styles and navigating communication structures and disclosures about who I am and what the what the value is that I bring to a space given my levels of Divergence so yeah that’s how I got it and I realized I think I said heart centered but what I meant was human-centered so no problem no problems that’s part of the process yeah yeah centered culture that we’re really trying to create and that’s really around the inclusion piece so I know a lot of people get confused because we keep changing the acronyms but there’s always a reason behind why we might add a particular letter to really focus in on something and so I noticed um Dr Carrie Ann in your title you um are a Dei a specialist and so we’ve seen Dei diversity equity and inclusion we’ve seen um de some of us have seen deij the day being for justice or deib to really focus in on belonging and so I’m curious what does the A stand for and what does that mean for you right so for for the space I’m operating in now it is talking about accessibility so fundamentally breaking down access so it’s it’s about how your organization um or your organization’s culture and dynamic really creates opportunities and access for its staff and professionals working with um with the organization to develop right so back to what you’re mentioning about the human-centered approach or human-centered design it’s really thinking critically about how space is allow for individuals with all of their Divergence and nuances to develop and grow and Thrive via access in the ways that they deem valuable and necessary for them so access for me May mean um being able to sign up for a particular type of coaching program versus access for another colleague of mine may simply mean the type of computer desk that they’re going to need to work from right so access spans a spectrum of many things it’s not just getting into an organization but how you are able to level up and navigate that organization once you’re in there I love that in my HR experience I found that we tend we would focus on the lower performers and the high performers or the high potential employees a lot and so when you do that what you’re ending up doing is you know you’re promoting and advancing and giving access to special opportunities to those with the most privilege and so even when you’re looking at Dei from one aspect either from the recruiting point or you know in terms of onboarding Etc right you have to look at your whole Talent pipeline how you’re developing that Talent Pipeline and who has access to the resources at each stage of that Pipeline and so I love that you focus in on that a to really understand not just from people from the point of view of the underrepresented group of folks who have disabilities or who are differently abled right also from you know if you are black indigenous person of color a woman um any sort of marginalized group LGBT EQ plus what limitations are there in the organization or what sort of invisible rules or invisible blockers exist who lose resources so yes love that Focus yeah yeah so let’s talk a little bit about your work and what a human first workplace even is like how would you define that sure so one of the polls that I remember um making some time back on LinkedIn you know when you randomly just have a thought you’re like this should be a LinkedIn post I had a little blog post up and I based on the work I was doing at the time recognized that Dei work is really coming back to the humanity aspect of who you know who we are how we are why we are in all of the spaces that we’re navigating not just work um so for me this this human-centered human design type of focus is fundamentally acknowledging the fact that at our core when we strip everything away human is what we’re dealing with human is what we’re talking about human is what we are supporting right and tapping into so and what a lot of people say to me um you know Dei doesn’t involve me it doesn’t involve me I’m a straight person I’m a man I’m white and whatever kind of thing I’m like yeah but at the end of the day you’re human correct it’s like oh yes so just fundamentally Being Human and all of the wonderful assets and strengths and gifts and talents because I always try to come from this asset-based side of things instead of the deficit-based side of things which we’ve focused on for far too long in our societies and think about all right great you’re human what are the experiences that you’ve had and how have those experiences taught you something helped to support you in something or someone else that we can then lean into as assets to create these Dynamic and culturally responsive work environments and social settings so it’s really leaning into the human side of things because we have um you know Maslow’s hierarchy of needs for instance we all have those needs regardless of Age religion nationality etc etc etc so fundamentally focusing on the human is the way that I push for this work to be done in PEI and the eia JB etc etc um but because that’s the most common element when we Whittle everything else away that’s the most common element and that is what um I championed for yeah I’m moving the work so yeah I love that I love that da work is coming back to humanity and I feel like in a way that’s so liberating whether you’re an underrepresented group or you are someone in the system that is has the most privilege and was given the most benefits because sometimes even when you are privileged that gives you permission to be a human and not be a robot in the workplace because the old style of leadership the command and control has been proven scientifically and I know you can you can attest to that has been proven scientifically not to work for anyone underrepresented groups so this human-centered approach this permission of you know Dei is really about coming back to humanity it’s just such a bigger calling in that way I love it yeah yeah and it’s the first thing that’s forgotten about too often right like we forget that we’re humans and I think that it happens so often in the tech space because there is so much computerized language and that’s normalized and referring to one another I don’t have the bandwidth for this or I need to recharge like I’m a battery and like how that affects how we even perceive ourselves let alone how we perceive others yes and just the yeah dismantling of humanity that comes in and how easy it is to then treat people as computers and the failure in that as a leader plugging in and the plugging out which I just started this series on I forget what network is on but it’s called Severance I I invite you guys to check out that that series because it it is sort of a metaphor I don’t want to spoil anything in this show but it is really sort of a metaphor for how we plug into work and plug out and aren’t human yeah and so it’s really coming back to that Humanity yeah and it’s it’s funny um that we say that because I was just earlier I was talking to Alexandra about the fact that people don’t even realize how traumatized they are yes and that is those are the groups of folks particularly in the professional space that I um I’m working with yes do you recognize that you have been or currently are going through yes active experience at work that your work space is toxic that your workspaces challenges are not conducive to your well-being and people are like but this is just work that’s how it’s supposed to be no [Laughter] of trauma and what has been normalized is acceptable just because it is doesn’t mean it should be and being able to challenge that and be like hey but like as a human I need this correct or as a human I see that this person is struggling or they need extra support and being able to show up in that humanity and prioritize those needs so that we can get back to work and we can produce and we can thrive in a space because we do that’s what we want as humans right we want to be valuable we want to produce we want those things absolutely but we have to be in a space in which we can yes and I think it goes back to what we’ve always been saying every Wednesday which is Dei really comes back to your why and so I think it’s really hard for people to really to to identify their why yeah when they haven’t healed from the trauma that they aren’t aware that they went through and I can attest to this because being in the corporate world for almost a decade there was a lot of relational trauma there was a lot of but I was in the HR space and so we we were the people people who were the ones who were who were really trying our best for everyone to make it an inclusive organization and I work for one of the best you know companies in my opinion still looking back at really walking the talk in those spaces but even when you’re doing that if you don’t have the right leadership in place from a business standpoint if it’s not integrated with the business if people haven’t healed from their own trauma because there are still things now like 15 years later that I’m and thinking oh my goodness I’ve internalized that and now I have to unpack it process it heal it so that I can be more productive not just so that we can be you know like get back to our roots of just you know not focusing on just work but it really helps us connect to our purpose and and why we show up to work or if we’re in the right role because as a leader you don’t want your employees to be in the wrong role that right role piece oh I I could talk for days about the right role piece what I what cringes for me when I look at certain things in the space um and people are applying for jobs or job descriptions because I have to vet those too when it comes to creating organizational culture and the wording of these things and this whole concept of being the right fit annoys me and I’m just going to use annoyance as the polite

you know um because there this whole idea of you pitching your organization in a way that now requires me to think about me being the fit for your organization I think starts the whole minimization process right and it’s like okay well this feels okay for me in this job description this looks okay over here but I’m not okay with this part does that mean I’m not the right fit right you know what what is what is the why the lack of inclusivity yes that organizations are not willing to say here’s what we stand for yada yada yada um here are the requirements please apply with it you know are you interested apply with it what does this need to say if you think you’re the right fit yeah and yes and that’s why one of my pet peeves is when people over complicate the hiring process right that’s one of the things we’re we’re out here to do is really simplify it because correct the ego becomes so involved has been scientifically studied the idiosyncratic Raider effect yep that rating says more about you as a human than it does about the fit and then when we focus on fit what we’re really saying is you need to sacrifice your authenticity hold yourself thing my idiosyncratic you know little quirks little ways of working all these kind of things but also the business ends up suffering because now I have a disengaged employee now I have someone who’s now dealing with me the anxiety and depression who’s calling in sick who’s not showing up for work and then comes in the command and control again with okay well now I gotta rein it in and we gotta we gotta start penalizing people for college we got to start laying people off and scaring them and into doing their job which it’s just not the way in 20 times away it’s and there’s certain things that I tell people are um sets up phrases you know sets up words it’s a word or phrase it’s about to set you up for failure right yeah

yeah where a family is another one yes yes with them out there um one last point for you guys we Have No Boundaries really that’s what that is we have no boundaries one last comment I want to make on this point around workplace drama I think uh Harvard Business review or Forbes I can’t remember who it was launched um an article a few weeks ago about it taking 22 months for someone to recover from a single work trauma experience and when you think about that as you’re saying Jesse there’s still things that you’re unpacking when you’re now you know however many years from a particular event yeah yeah and when you think about how people are moving from job to job just so they can keep up with paying the bills Etc and never really processing through a particular workplace trauma event because we’re going to talk about one event much less the compounded events of traumas in a workplace it lends to a lot of the things that we’re now like all of a sudden surprised about when we talk about the great resignation high levels of burnout um issues around the suicide rates going up across different populations yes so a lot of this stuff is starting from work our works are not safe it’s not so I did want to throw that out for folks really think about what you are feeling in your workspace and how you keep telling yourself yeah I just have to pay the bills I just have to push through you know because that is keeping you in survival mode okay you cannot heal until you move to surviving mode correct correct and that has been my experience any sort of trauma I’ve had whether at work or in my personal life yes the anxiety or the depression or whatever came after it didn’t happen until everything was safe absolutely likewise once I felt safe that’s when everything everything just kind of hit the fan and I said why I’m through it now I did it I’m safe now right right why is it that now and so so many people when they’re stuck in that survival mode the only way and I think this kind of speaks to my next question which is about the red flags and so maybe one of the red flags is burnout yep right so look up those symptoms of burnout right if you’re burning out as a leader first that’s a red flag if employees are calling sick if employees are and so what do you think Dr carrion what are some of the other symptoms or red flags because we’re looking at this as a system and that’s why I love your area of research your area of work because we’re not just looking at the individual or the individual the interpersonal relationships we’re looking at the organization at them living in a broader culture and so when we’re looking at it really from that broader lens what are some of those red flags or symptoms that people are seeing on the surface yeah so what you see on the surface from an organizational standpoint when things are just not um running so smoothly and people are going to be like no but that’s a norm things

having too many meetings is a sign of systematic failure it’s like glitch you still we have a problem um when you have an organizational culture where it’s a meeting every striking day back to back and that’s kind of thing poor management poor leadership structures are at play right and a lot of people will be like but that’s normal here is what that then lends to when you’re thinking about how I as a individual function in those environments I don’t eat lunch in the bathroom I may be having upset stomach on the way to work those anxiety knots right I have these incessant migraines that are happening I’m now missing days at the gym I’m out of shape it manifests in so many ways that it is not even cute I can’t even I can’t decorate this for folks um even with another sign with an organization so those two excessive meetings it’s like a No-No um when you also see to the point of access when you you noted Jacqueline earlier about certain people getting the access versus others on a consistent business with these half-assed justifications another red flag Houston we have some serious problems um you’ll also recognize too in some organizations the ways in which leadership itself is made up right when you look at the quote-unquote leadership tear what those folks look like because we’re we’re highly visual right how those individuals engage each other on that Terror and engage those not in that Terror or the lack thereof engagement other things that should flag for you that these folks aren’t walking the talk because remember black and white can communicate all sorts of stuff all day but when you’re in the space and you’re you’re seeing and feeling the operations of things and it’s not matching up some Flags some real Flags I always tell people three things what does it look like for you it sounds like for you and feel like for you and if you are cringing at all those it’s a it’s a moment where you need to think about how to Pivot yeah yeah I would agree like all those are definitely red flags and the thing that I want to say about the meeting specifically is you can have meetings but they need to be effective meetings and if you’re having meetings about having meetings you’re not having effective meetings you’re not communicating effectively you don’t have clear outcomes and you don’t have the structure in place to actually make them actionable and so noticing how many meetings are we having do we have to have these meetings could it have been an email I think that’s an important question if you say oh well I couldn’t have effectively communicated that over an email okay is there a communication problem right is there an understanding problem are you measuring the right things how do you know if you had the impact and really evaluating what is an effective meeting look like and feel like within your organization correct one that I’d like to add to is are you in in a mindset where you’re having to revert to command and control leadership or are you leveraging human psychology and what helps us Thrive I want to lean into that I really appreciate you bringing that up because in some other um conversations and workshops that I do I talk about leadership versus management remember I used to and I remember teaching this too when I when I was lecturing as a professor and folks would would conclude that oh we don’t actually have many leaders and I’d be like yeah you’re right leaders are folks who inspire and are able to um activate inner leaders in others right they are individuals who create a Level Playing Field so that the nuances the assets of individuals can be seen valued and activated for whatever level of execution of work needs to be done right those those are leaders leaders activate give Vision give inspiration yes and work with work alongside right managers it’s this tug of war right that telling you the command as you’re saying um Jesse they’re telling you this is what needs to be done and they’re pulling you along to do it and people think that that’s leadership that’s not leadership right that’s not it um a lot of good leaders go unrecognized because they’re part of the pack they’re not separate from and I think the ways in which many of our organizations have been structured we say the word leader we’re thinking the person on top um and

I dare I say that that person is really just a poster child offend anybody yeah I think it depends on the organization how are they showing up as a leader are they showing up as a leader which means that they are empowering everyone around them to show up in their strengths and in their ads right and that’s again the conversation about oh be a Fit versus being an ad because you want to be able to cultivate a full spectrum of strengths and being aware of what you don’t have and your team should then fill that right everybody has an ad that they can give and so are you a poster child are you playing at being a leader because you hold that title and you’re like oh I have the title that’s good enough right or are you showing up in leadership and creating opportunities for everybody around you to grow and to show up in their strength and their knowledge and be able to be Innovative and collaborative yeah are you showing growing up and upholding their humanity and what they add to the organization

um Alexandra as you’re saying that showing up and doing these things and cultivating and activating and inspiring the word is consistently yes and not defaulting to okay I’ve done it now now I can go back on top and you know tell them yeah I just wanted to say something about the poster child because I don’t want if you’re a leader who’s also an underrepresented group you don’t need to feel guilty about that because you might be ready to show up and be consistent and remove barriers but you can be the poster child in the sense that yes I got to this management level so now this was the only way I was going to get a pay raise right because you know in pyramid organizations you’re an individual contributor whether you’re an engineer whether you’re another sort of tech focused person you realize at a certain point I’m not going to get more money unless I become a leader and so they’re the people who come into those positions for those reasons and then there are the tokenized and again we’re not trying to offend anybody but no no it’s your experience and you feel like you’ve been tokenized because I have a lot I’m passionate about this because a lot of my clients are female like women leaders right and so they’ve been put in positions where they’re supposed to be strategic where they’re supposed to be leading a lot of people management correctly impaired and a lot of the women are trying to do this this proper type of leadership where a meme that comes to my mind is you’re not a leader until you’ve created a leader who can create another leader who can create another leader right it’s not about you always having to be present that’s the ego-based leadership I have so many clients who are doing all the right things and and working on their personal development no matter what if they’re outnumbered in the room they’re the first of their group to be in the room and they happen to have different values and different identities and and different ways of communicating different culture Etc and they’re trying to bring that lens to a leadership team that has been operating the way it’s been operating for decades right and like just inheriting the same problems as the previous generation it can be really hard because I have a lot of underrepresented clients who are at director level and they have been told you are VP potential you are senior whatever potential but they’re like I don’t know if I want to do it I know I can do it I know I’m talented enough to do it but nobody’s taking me seriously I’m having to work twice as hard I’m have to I have to perform again and again and again where my male colleague or my colleague is automatically just given free reign to do whatever they want where I have to bring in all this data and it’s just not always fair and so if you’re feeling like you have been made the poster child or you’re like trying to post as you know a manager because you haven’t been given the leadership training you know you can come to us for one we can help you understand what the level levers are for change in your unique situation because it’s always different right and so and sometimes it means leaving right yes yes sometimes people aren’t ready to hear it and sometimes it takes a while but often it is about positioning you for somewhere an organization where you will Thrive and that’s why we’re working on both ends here at disruptors to help people understand where the barriers where the biases are so they can get to work but also help organizations understand you’re hiring diverse Talent you need to understand really what Dei means not just for these underrepresented groups but for everyone so we’re bringing human to the heart of what we do absolutely absolutely yeah yeah remaining in that human-centeredness and why it’s important and I guess making the business case for it right because we’re still in that space in which we have to make the business case that this is important and not just the right thing to do having Innovative like having diverse teams creates Innovation creates sustainability creates all of the things that companies want for themselves and creating those environments in which you are empowering all of your leadership team then empowers all of their teams and you can do wonderful beautiful things but that’s where you have to start catching the bias which is why we’re doing whole series next month on catching bias in the interview process catching bias within your organization and your favorite Dr Carrie Anne we’re going to talk about looking for culture ad not culture fit

if that’s something that you think might be happening at your organization make sure you join us next month but I want to move into we talked about the red flags and symptoms how could you correct those what would be some easy things that people could do to start correcting when they see those red flags showing up in the organization sure sure so I’ll start with the individual first so things like the the headaches the um the fatigue the not being interested all the things that people go through which are then lead up to the a diagnosis of burnout or a diagnosis of something else which can actually be very severe um right because people get so sick and don’t realize that they’re getting sick and I’ve had personal experience with that given my work environments so you have those those pieces really leading into the opportunity to take the mental health days using your sick time right a lot of us try and Bank up sick time or try and Bank up Vacations so you can have a big blowout two weeks of some time and then you have two weeks in a whole year and then have to come back and sit for a whole another year before you like think about the utility of that um really leaning into the opportunities that you have to use other time and I know for some organizations it takes forever to rack up vacation time but um figuring out how to take time out for yourself is is critical I would even push people to really and I’m saying push because a lot of people are sitting and and just kind of oh I’ll get to it I’ll wait and see and that phrase wait and see I cannot um other another one that really just

um there are there are coaches out here you have three sitting right in front of you right here right pick one and pick one and one with a coach go you do not have to be doing these things alone you don’t have to create your professional track plan alone I tell people all the time have a professional draft plan that’s something I work with people on um like that one right there whether you are a job Seeker who’s moving into something or an individual contributor or you’re a leader of a team who needs support doing this and you don’t have it in your organization there are tons of supports outside of your organization like you’re not alone you can Google it there’s three right here we make it super easy for you but get the support you mean okay I think that’s super important it’s there’s so much support oh there so much support um I would then for organization friends that are just you know having all these meetings like really take stock do a cultural audit yeah do a cultural audit to the points that were made earlier what is what are these meetings benefiting us how is there work that actually is done after the meeting um you know are people feeling empowered and inspired after these meetings or is it just another role as okay let me just go to this again to hear what we talked about six months ago and no traction has been developed yes you’re like what are we really meeting for yeah um

creative and dynamic ways to meet you know they’re being now more so in a virtual space a lot of organizations have had to think about how they can get the information that they need without having formal meeting structures something that a lot of of folks need to think through a little bit more that you don’t need to have this hour block of a conversation yeah sometimes it could be you know having an open room on Zoom for people to drop in during a lunch break and say hey here’s a thought about something get idea it can be very informal yeah more conducive to hearing people’s yes assets that means yeah I think that’s where some people get confused too because when they hear the advice of okay don’t have a meeting for no reason that doesn’t mean that you are then packing your meetings with like a like overwhelming agenda because you also have to have intentional meetings where there is deliberate space yeah and if you’re creating a deliberate space to check in from a cultural audit perspective and it’s quiet that is a red flag that you know a topic that I know Dr carrion you’re very passionate about is that you don’t have psychological safety don’t have it you don’t have it because employees have in the past brought things up and felt dismissed felt it’s validated were punished even they’re bringing it up being seen as not a team player someone who asks too many questions someone who challenges the status quo too much um not playing the game not playing the game that wasn’t designed for them to begin with by the way but not playing the game right and so people get deflated and that’s where they get into like this sort of quiet quitting Trend whereas Trend it’s been around forever disengaging from work forever we just have a new word for it that’s when they disengage and say I don’t feel safe here and but I need a paycheck so I’m gonna try to hang on to my job right and maybe they’re taking care of their Mental Health on side maybe they’re not but don’t put it all on your employees to say okay because this I’ve seen this happen in my previous corporate days where leaders say use your vacation use your vacation use your vacation but you’re looking at your agenda and you’re looking at all the deliverables you have your end and you’re like but if I use my vacation I’m not gonna like you know when we’re looking at synchronous work I’m not going to be able to get these stakeholders I’m not going to be able to deliver on this my Merit increase is going to be lower my bonus is going to be lower and I really want that money so I can go on that vacation because I feel so Versed

and this is what I’m saying organizations when they when they really take stock of their structure half the time if not more it’s a setup it’s a trap it is a trap and I want to talk about the radical responsibility that the leadership team needs to hold in if your people aren’t taking vacation if your people are burned down if your people aren’t communicating if they are disengaged leadership did something wrong absolutely you have to start with leadership because you’re the one creating that structure talk about the companies like there’s so many tech companies unlimited PTO okay you have unlimited PTO but do people actually get to be off on their PTO do you actually have a structure in which people can take that PTO and disengage or are they expected to work on their PTO and vacation do you have a required minimum because we have such a culture of work in the United States that people won’t take it if they’re not forced to and so what are you holding in responsibility as the leader for how your teams are showing up because it starts with you yeah and how is what you’re saying like take your vacation we we value work like balance how is that misaligned to what you’re doing yes oh gosh because you might be saying that but you’re working late at night sending emails at 11 PM booking you know early morning check-ins and doing all this to create that that workflow number one but also as the model leader people are seeing watching you they they know that if they want to get to your level that’s one of the reasons why I opted out of the corporate world because I was just not I could not find role models

all these things and so especially when I became a mom I was like no I got twins I’m not bringing my double breast pump too yeah the site and like you know male dominated environment and some people did do that and people were wrong in on them and we didn’t you know in our in our corporate office we had a room for that but like at the site we didn’t and so there were all these things that it was just like like the world kept telling me I don’t fit in here yeah do you believe them yeah yeah it’s like it’s a it’s again I don’t mean to be rude or insulting but it’s a trap no

shipped to a positive note so what we are here to do is to help you yes instead of creating a trap yeah you’re deliberately creating a system where everyone thrives human centered so we’re inviting you in to reimagine yes because I have seen like organizations or parts of businesses where the morale was super low and a good leader did step in and was able to create systemic change right right and like and one of the most inclusive leaders that comes to my mind was a white male and he just it was in and he he’s the one who really um embodied that Maya Angelou quote for me which is people will forget what you said at what you did but they’ll really remember how you made how you made me feel and he went that for me when he was present in a meeting when he was like you just felt that he was there you felt that he was listening to you you felt that he cared on a deep level that he knew you just really trying to get to know the human yeah behind the title yeah yeah yeah yeah and so that’s what we’re here to do we’re here to help you become those inspiring leaders guess what you don’t have to work as hard either

everything becomes easier yes yeah I think that’s super important to highlight because so many people don’t want to engage in this work because it feels like extra work it feels like piling on like I already can’t keep up with all these things how am I supposed to do this if you create a space in which your team is thriving and showing up and engaged it’s not as heavy of a lift right every time you have to move in have to quote unquote you don’t have to ever move into that power and control something went off the rails something went wrong There’s an opportunity to resolve the thing that is causing you to think you have to micromanage right and so go back like what happened check in with the humans what do they need what are their bottlenecks what are their obstacles and then remove them that’s way easier than trying to just push people past burnout like it’s not gonna I could tell you as a career coach most of these people have good intentions and the thing that they need to thrive is usually so easy it’s free right like we we like cost effectively yeah usually free right if people are asking for raises and all these kind of things that’s just a symptom that the system is broken as well you won’t have to because like that’s one of the reasons I left HR is because we were just so always focused on compensation but the reason we were so focused on compensation is because people needed justification for why they were sacrificing their life yeah yeah right and so when you were truly happy and connected to your work you’re not complaining about salary anymore you’re like you know what I’ve seen it and I am happy here and I know I can take my time off I know I can have the lifestyle I want and so that extra twenty thousand dollars doesn’t matter to me yeah and it may not for some people but for others it does and I think that that’s the importance of the what inclusion means or even Equity means to people because that’s not the same thing for everybody people are going to have different checklists included means to them exactly they have different needs different desires and I think normalizing that not every company can be for every person and not every person can be for every company and that’s okay yeah there is plenty to go around absolutely that’s okay but if you notice that your company is all white men for example not to pick on not to pick on y’all we love you but but if you notice that you notice that then it’s so I’m saying your company’s not for everyone but if you’re saying your company is not for people who are underrepresented then think about how that’s impacting your business as well for sure yeah because if you’re if you’re if you don’t want your if you want your customers you want to go into new markets you don’t understand you’re going to need diversity to really understand the pain points right and also like it’s it’s something that can I mean this is not your this shouldn’t be your why but it’s something that can get you in trouble down the road it can be a marketing crisis it can be and so you know it’s 20 20. it’s almost 2023 and so I’m already in 2023 by the way I think I said that a couple times but you might as well in 2022 but it’s 2023 and like that’s it it’s this make this the year that you really show up intentionally yes that’s that’s the part that um uh leadership needs to understand is the intention needs to be good it needs to be a whole I’m not going to say pure I’m not going to say that the intention needs to be wholesome and authentic because a lot of times it is oh you said it I need to diversify so I can get into other markets that’s not a good intention that motivation right there that’s not a no no um you should be serious about getting into other markets because your service is going to support and Elevate something not just because of your benefit and wanting to make you know better bottom lines but the intention needs to be authentic and wholesome um because one of the questions I really like to um ask my clients when it comes to this like finding their authentic why or their passion for Dei or their passion for whatever it is that they’re doing whether it’s an underrepresented group they’re trying to help is what really breaks your heart like what is really breaking your heart like when it comes to Dei right and how does your business help to solve these problems right right in whatever ways like get creative but really start from what authentically you will because that’s the thing you need motivation to stay on the path and motivation cannot be manufactured right neither can connection that question too for me really is asking what is how do you see yourself as connected to or a part of um inclusion because some people will answer and say Well since Dei is a practice or an approach here’s what I think right completely void of any connection like I said before Dei is getting back to the human of our since it’s in the workspace of our workspaces right so if you get certain and and then you know you know certain answers that you get you’re like yeah this person doesn’t even recognize that they are they are a Dei yes and they’re not even paying attention to it or they think of it their knee-jerk reaction is to think of racism and today yeah I’m not racist I’m not racist it’s like oh God no one said anything about right it might be not racist but you we all have internalized racism within us because we all grew up in a racist Society right like that is just a fact and so and I’ve said this before it’s really about aligning looking at what your similarities are to this

and not to feel guilty about your privilege but understand that things are different things right like we all have challenges in life but some things were easier for you and to please also recognize that privilege is a dive is Divergent like it’s what your privilege is doesn’t mean that I don’t have the same or similar yes right it’s intersectional yeah right there there are differences to privilege because I think in America particularly when we think about the standard of privilege being white privilege because in some cases I would never want that yeah I’m good not having that standard I have other things that are privileges for me yeah that white people may not have so you know I think we need to also recognize that there’s a lot of spectrum in what we’re talking about and how we need to operate and um what we need to value and honor in that again the difference and and and levels of continuity and different intersectionalities absolutely because then we’re not painting a group with a broad brush either and saying okay because then when people start thinking from that perspective everyone in this group is marginalized again that’s superiority that that that um power Dynamic where you are now speaking down to someone or being overly sensitive and then and then and then you know that you’re being treated differently and so and also for for myself like I’m a woman of color but I recognize that I have a lot of privilege and so I I understand what it’s like to be specifically an Indian woman in a way like you know that no one else of any other group can understand but at the same time I I have proximity to power in a lot of different ways and so yeah I might have got there you know my my journey here might have been a little bit different than others right but it doesn’t mean like we just say okay these people are not privileged these people are privileged interceptional no yeah and I think the thing right there in what you’re talking about earlier Dr Carrie Anne is acknowledging your connection to it right you can’t begin to heal something you can’t begin to work on something or to grow in something until you acknowledge what is there or isn’t there right unchecked bias exists because it’s not been checked you’re not aware of what’s happening so until you can connect to what is my connection to diversity equity and inclusion how do I show up on this and stop talking about it like it’s something external to you we won’t be able to make moves in big ways so once people start connecting to okay this is how this shows up for me then people can start to see beyond their own noses and making systemic change that needs to happen yes so how are you connected to Dei as a human first yes or a human you’re not a robot how are you connected to Dei and so on that note that might be one question you can take away from today as a leader or even as an underrepresented group watching this how are you uniquely connected to Dei what is your where are your barriers where is your like I draw from standpoint Theory a lot like what are what that nobody else can see so we all think we have to be experts in this to start the work but no you have a unique lens there’s something you can see that none of us on this panel can even see right now and you can share with us and and so so start with how are you connected to Dei what else are Dr Carrie Ann am I may be missing when we think about an easy place for people to start that might be you know low effort high impact of course we’ve been connecting with a coach connecting with someone in this space to help help you understand where your gaps are understand what goals you need to set but what else might be the low hanging fruit that where people can start to see changes right away yeah I think if you start with just those three things that I talked about earlier how you feel yeah how do things sound to you and how do things look to you right like taking a personal kind of stance and how what do those things look sound and feel like now and then how do you want them to look sound and feel like in true practice in true application yes right of of things that are that are inclusive of things that are um actually psychologically safe yes um because I think we’re doing a good job with the diversity stuff we’ve done pretty good with having diverse things great we’re still the equity is a little shaky and inclusion really isn’t there yet places are really not as inclusive as they think they are yeah um because for me inclusivity a big part of that is a psych safety and that’s not happening um accessibility is happening in many places and again it depends on the capacity of the organization yeah they’re able to do in-house versus connect um outside for certain development or resourcing so those are that one I think you know just

connect where can you connect right now where do you see yourself looking at things differently and then those three points sound feel now and what you would like it to look something feel like yeah yeah so as we close out today uh if you are a employer or a company or on a leadership team and some of these red flags showed up as you’re like oh that’s interesting uh you have to call Dr carrion you can also call Jasmine and I we are doing a free Dei evaluation for companies right now so head over to our website jobdisruptors.com and click on I’m hiring and you can fill out our questionnaire and we’ll be in contact with you if you are a job seeker and you are looking for companies that are prioritizing diversity equity and inclusion and go over to jobdisruptors.com and click on hire me and you can sign up for our job board we have a whole bunch of really interesting positions that are listed right now that we’re trying to get filled for companies that are great places to work so don’t hesitate to reach out to us you can also follow us here so that you can get notifications of everything happening and next month we will be diving into unpacking bias and being a culture ad and not a culture fit so make sure that you watch out for those events upcoming Dr carrion is there anything that you would like to share before we go sure folks can reach out to me as well as they please parent consultingllc.org is where you can find me or on Instagram you know everybody has to have an Instagram these days Dr dot Kerry underscore p is where I am but um yeah I’m available and Linkedin definitely find me on LinkedIn I’m I’m on LinkedIn Non-Stop so folks can connect with me there and um running starting to put together our coaching programs we’re already having applications for our coaching program starting in the new year for managers or leaders folks who are interested in just getting out of the burnout and Trauma and figuring out a different approach through Dei for their workspaces so connect with me as well perfect we’re so glad that you came with us today is there anything that you would like to add before we close today not too much I genuinely really enjoyed the conversation today I feel like it gives me a new energy to take away with me into this work because it is hard work it is if you’re in this space and you’re passionate about Dei as well please share this with people so that they can you know start to marinate on how they’re going to connect to Dei because we really want to create that ripple effect in the world so please share this and we will be putting this into a podcast format soon as well and so we know that not everyone can be here live on the LinkedIn so stay tuned for that because you’ll be able to access all of these via podcasts yeah starts January 4th actually it’ll start with the launch event that Dr Carrie Anne was also a part of when we first launched a while ago so those podcasts will start coming out on Spotify and apple podcast January follow our page for announcements about that as well well thank you everybody for joining today like Jasleen said please share this with anybody who you think might find it valuable and we will look forward to seeing you after the New Year yes stay safe